Credit Shrinking

Cop

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#1
I thought those deserved a post of its own... I need to rant

I'm glad Charlie Brooker brought it up... its a pet hate of mine. Whats the point in having them credits if you cant read them, and spending money on composers and musicians if your going to have some bloke trying to sell you the audio book or whats coming up, and just wittering over the top!?

Also what annoys me is when a caption comes up telling you whats on next... BBC THREE is the worst for it too! With those little bastard aliens telling me there there is more Family Guy coming up.... I KNOW i have digital television, I know what whats coming on!

Living TV do it thoughout the show, reminding me when America's Next Top Model is on... I don't care! I'm watching Jerry Springer, stop bothering me!

Grrrr I fucking hate that me. And the big channel logo in the top corner, does have to be so big? Does it have to be there?

Rant over.... fucking television
 

Cop

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#2
"From now on they're going to cram the credits into a teeny box and fill the rest of your screen with squawking exhortations to stay tuned for Judge John Pissing Deed. Every. Single. Time."

Charlie Brooker

Saturday May 12, 2007

The Guardian

Pay attention. You're going to read this. Sit up. Concentrate on my words. This is important. Something terrible is about to happen.

I was first alerted by an email from reader Mark Liversidge, with the subject line A Cry For Help. In it, he complained about the BBC's new "end credit delivery policy", the effects of which will be seen on screen from June 4 onwards. There's a preview, complete with mocked-up screengrabs, at www.bbc.co.uk/commissioning/credits/position.shtml - but in case you're not near a computer, or you're allergic to the internet, or (most likely) you think it all sounds a bit dull and couldn't be arsed, let me summarise neatly in 12 words: the BBC are about to ruin the ending of everything they show.

For several years now, end credits have been maltreated by all the networks; regularly squashed to one side, babbled and scribbled over, in a desperate bid to keep you watching, or sell you a spin-off DVD, or force you to visit a website. Why? Because you're not a "person" any more, bucko - you're a "content consumer", and the omni-powerful shit-committee that runs absolutely everything these days can't bear to leave you alone for a second. It has to keep prodding you and prodding you and prodding you, like a hog in a cage that has to be kept awake at all costs.

So credits are squashed and squeezed. Most viewers don't notice or care, but to spods like me, it's like watching a dog owner violently jerking their pet's lead in the street, shouting "hurry up" and booting its arse. It's not that I want to scan the credits and find out who's who: I just want to enjoy a small breathing space before the next programme. And listen to the theme tune without being yelled at.

Anyway, until now some programme makers have been able to find a way round the squeezing. I know this because I did it myself. On my BBC4 show Screenwipe, we deliberately fill our credits with jokes or footage or dialogue, partly because we're trying to make a show with at least a vague whiff of personality, but mainly because it stops "them" messing with it. But now, thanks to the new rules, we won't be able to do that any more when the show returns in the autumn.

Instead, "end credits should run over visually interesting graphics or live action but the content must not be editorially critical to the integrity of the programme or include speech... programme trails, solicits or helplines [within] end credits are no longer allowed."

Why? Because from now on they're going to cram the credits into a teeny box and fill the rest of your screen with squawking exhortations to stay tuned for Judge John Pissing Deed. Every. Single. Time.

That's it, at a stroke. No more enjoying the Doctor Who theme tune. No more '"You Have Been Watching". No more dramatic coda following the final credit. No more Pythonesque fun-with-mock-continuity. None of that. Instead, shows must slide into and over each other, turning the schedule into one big TV megamix; meaningless imagery gushing from a tap. Because they're terrified you might exhibit free will and turn over.

As ever, it's all the fault of people with charts and computers and expensive shirts and frail imaginations, of course; people who delight in proving beyond all doubt that old-fashioned credit sequences caused viewers to start flipping. And you can't argue with their figures, because numerically they're right. But aesthetically they're wrong. And aesthetics matter in a way that can't be detected in Microsoft Excel.

Slowly, surely, these bastards are wrecking the universe; turning everything into a gaudy festival of tactless shouting. Thanks to their meddling, I'm going to have to stand behind my own end credits, in a stamp-sized window, thronged with virtual hoardings, saluting them and their latest idiotic triumph.

Rub a little more shit on all our noses, world. That's the way. Thank you.
 

Booth

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#3
[YT=Charlie Brooker on Credit Shrinking]Yrm2dj6bIU0[/YT]




Channel logo's can play havoc with some plasma screens too because of image retention.

Ironically Charlie Brooker's Screen Wipe, which completely rips to shreds television programming, is one of the best things on television at the moment. It's the highlight of my weekly viewing.
 

Joanna

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#4
Beat me to posting that very same clip, Mike! :D

Anyway, glad you started this thread, Cop, as I absolutely loathe end credit squishing/yakking over too. Gawd bless Charlie Brooker for highlighting this. Couldn't agree with him more.

As he says, it's nice to have a bit of a mental breather after a programme, regardless of whether you're about to watch something else or not. Say you've just watched a moving programme and are feeling a bit teary. Usually the programme will then wind down with some suitably moving music, which you just want to wash over you for a minute....but which you can't because some shouty chirpy announcer wants to tell you all about the hilarious comedy show that's to follow it...oh, and about a great film that isn't even on for days. Heehee - NOT! Some programmes (ie Doctor Who) have great theme tunes, and so you might just want to enjoy them and take them in for a minute as the show ends. Well, that's what you'd like to do, anyway...

You might also want to seek out a particular name in the credits. You might, say, have particularly liked the performance/character of a certain actor and want to know who that actor is. You might have loved the incidental music and want to know who the composer was. Very difficult to do all this when the credits are squished and minimized on the screen. And I don't want to have the credits ruined so that all the comedy shows that are to come the following evening can be advertised over them. I can find all these things out for myself. And there are always trailers 'in-between' shows that serve this purpose well enough.

And what is the point of trailing clips for a show that is about a minute away from starting? You're either going to be watching it anyway and so will see said clip content soon enough, or aren't going to be watching it and so are not bothered about seeing a clip from a show you aren't interested in. Trailers that are properly in advance of a show are fine, for those who don't mind the spoilers, but one's literally as a programme are starting are pointless, in my opinion.

And yes, Cop, I also hate the advertising banners that appear as a show is still running. They are big, completely in the way of what you are trying to watch and just take you out of the 'action' of the scene. You're just wishing them off the screen as quickly as possible and not actually paying any attention to what they are saying...it's the programme you're watching that you want to pay attention to. They don't even just advertise the programme coming up, as they sometimes promo programmes/films that aren't even on till the next week.

Know you remember those horrible 'Shaun the Sheep' promos during Neighbours, Laura. There was a short spell a while ago when, shortly before Neighbours finished, that a dancing Shaun the sheep would appear right over the picture so it could make sure you knew that that particular show was about to air on CBBC or something. Blooming annoying.

Then what of the cast/crew of a particular programme? Having worked hard on a show, it must be lovely to then see your name in the credits. Must be great to have this bit of publc acknowledgement for your part in it. Well, credit squishing has spoiled that too.

Far worse in America, though, as I gather the situation with programme trails is present to a far greater extent than it is in this country. Apparently, the number of ad breaks they have is a bit ridiculous too. Doesn't make how things are here any less annoying, though.

I've always loved credits like those for 'Allo 'Allo', where you can not only clearly see who plays who, but see character vignettes at the same time.

Grumble grumble...Now this is a prime example of what end credits should be like....

[yt=Dad's Army end credits]TVlqQhjP0B0[/yt]

xx Joanna xx

PS: After seeing the name Mykola Pawluk in so many different lots of end credits, I often used to wonder who 'he' was too! :D
 

Cop

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#5
I used to always look out for Chas Watts, as one of my bestest mates in Primary School was called Chas, and another mate who had the surname Watts... and I still look for his name today... :)

I cant stand fast credits either... American TV Shows are the worst for that

*Actually, the more I think about it, its because of see Chas' name I think first got me interested in television production... remind me to mention him in my BAFTA speech one day
 

LovelyLaura

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#6
Credit shrinking is one of the most annoying things in the world, I hate it :mad: And it seems to have got even worse in the last year too :( I think the BBC said in response to criticism about their new end credits that they did some kind of market research and this research told them that most people don't bother watching them anyway, which I personally think is a load of rubbish :rolleyes: I don't know anyone who doesn't like to watch the end credits, whether it's to find out the name of an actor or to find out who has written a show etc.

I noticed this week that ITV have finally given Corrie some decent end credits which feature a series of moving images of the street....but what was the point in creating these new credits when they just advertised the next programmes on all the ITV channels over the top?! :rolleyes: I loathe such advertising.....if I want to watch something else then I'll just see what's on by checking the EPG! I don't need constant reminders of what's on.
 

Fran

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#7
I agree with all of the above, but I'm bit too shattered to put it into my own words, o_O however, just to add... I also hate it when I go to the cinema and everyone stands up and starts to leave almost as soon as the last words are spoken! I want to sit and watch the credits and see who was involved in making the film, apart from anything else, the least you can do is read the names as a sign of appreciation to those involved, but if I've seen a good actor I want to know who they were, or see if I recognise any of the production names. Anyone would think those extra few minutes would cause the end of the world the way some people rush out. Grrrrrrr. :mad: What's worse is when it's your own family dragging you out early and you have to go with them or walk home. :confused: :eek:
 

Joanna

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#8
Fran said:
if I've seen a good actor I want to know who they were
Yeah, when I was watching the fab This is England, I wanted to know the name of the actor playing Woody. He really convinced me in the role and I just wanted to know the name of the actor whose performance I had found so good. Cue credits...Joe Gilgun! (Yeah, I know I could of just found out later on, but not quite the same as finding out while you are still in the 'moment' of the film!)

xx Joanna xx
 

Cop

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#9
Here is a reply from BBC regarding Credit Shrinking

"Thank you for your e-mail.

We are improving the way that we inform viewers about what content is available across BBC channels/network. This could be additional material associated with the programme that viewers have just watched or upcoming programmes on that same channel or another BBC network that we feel viewers may like to know about. All material featured in our end credits will be carefully thought through.

More importantly, the BBC has a remit to promote digital uptake - credit squeezing, along with trails, will enable us to introduce audiences to new digital services and programmes.

Credit 'squeezing' is already used in some BBC programmes and has become increasingly important with the growth of media channels.

While more choice is good for our audiences, it does make it harder to inform them about new BBC programmes they might like to watch. We hope this clear navigation from one programme to another will enable people to find out about other BBC programmes we hope they will enjoy.

Nevertheless, please be assured I have registered your comments regarding this issue and have made them available to production teams and the senior BBC management. Feedback of this nature helps us when making decisions about future BBC programmes and your comment will play a part in this process.

Thank you again for taking the time to contact the BBC.

Regards"

Post number 500 for Cop by the way - whooooo
 

Joanna

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#10
What an absolute pile of stinking f....ng...Does that next word start with a 'b'? 'B'...er...'o'...er...Ah no, sorry, can't quite make out the rest as the Beeb have squished it all out of all legibility!

xx Joanna xx

PS: Congrats, Cop, on making it to the big 50...0!
 

Gorf

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#11
Surely, having a placement standard that is just begging for someone who does their credits in something like After Effects to walk right up to the camera, step around (in front of) the credits themselves, and yell over the link voiceover "I've seen it. It's crap - switch over to Channel 4 they've got something by Luc Bessson showing in ten minutes. Go and put the kettle on. When did you last ring your mother?" etc.
 

Gorf

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#12
Fran said:
...however, just to add... I also hate it when I go to the cinema and everyone stands up and starts to leave almost as soon as the last words are spoken!...
I told a woman to sit down or go yesterday, as she did that at the end of "Ratatouille" - I wanted to see if I knew anyone (I'm an a few animators' lists).
 

Joanna

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#13
:mad: ARGH, BLOODY ARGH! :mad: Didn't catch it all, but have been watching the BBC4 repeat of the last episode of Lead Balloon. Anyway, it came to the end credits, the 'action' still rolling...and they only went and still squished it into a small box! :mad: They could at the very least leave a show intact when it isn't just the credits that are being shown. Completely spoilt the prog's closing scene for me. Was a total distraction, and obviously made it more difficult to see what was going on...well, what with me having to view it in a small box in the corner of my TV screen - and with a voice-over over the closing theme tune (which you could barely hear!)! I haven't so far been watching the BBC4 repeats of this seris of LB, but I presume this happens every week. Really wish the Beeb would sort themselves out over this credit 'squishing' - especially when I think they take it too far and actually do it so it ruins the programme itself. Who actually likes this credit squishing? Suppose there's the odd person who isn't that fussed by it. That isn't the same as actually thinking it's a good thing - which it bloody well ain't! It's basically just totally disrespectful to both the viewer and to the cast/crew of the show. To get shows out there there obviously has to be a business side to things, but the people who make the decisions on how shows/promotion are actually presented need to really start thinking on those it all is presented to: us, the viewer! Having 2 fingers regularly stuck up at us is most certainly not appreciated. As you can tell, I'm very pissed off about all this. :mad: Rant over....

xx Joanna xx
 
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